MELISSA BROWNE

This Candid chat with Melissa Browne opens the so-called faux par conversation around money. What your learned money beliefs bring to the table when it comes to your personal finances and how you can understand them and use them to become comfortable and achieve goals when it comes to money.  Sex was a conversation not spoken of in public til sex and the city made it the norm, Melissa would love that to be the case with money as the more conversations we have the more we understand and can help one another rather than judge. With books such as “unf..k your finances, Fabulous but broke, More money for shoes” under her belt this is not a dull conversation with your normal accountant– everything is on the table and nothing held back. It’s time to get down and dirty with your money conversations.

Which one of Mel's faces resembles yours when it comes to finances?

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WHAT ATTRACTED YOU TO FINANCE?
Initially nothing. I wanted to be a lawyer, I grew up watching LA law, which is absolutely going to show at my age. I wanted the glamorous world of law. When I started studying, I realised it just wasn't that glamorous. I just didn't enjoy it. My dad was an accountant he said you’re good at math so why don't you do that instead? And I wanted to make him happy.
​So I became an accountant.
I went through my divorce at age 33 and that's when I just took a moment to figure out what I wanted to do with my life. I started reading, launched myself into books and I realised that I loved business and that was the thing that I had a real hunger for. And of course, as I helped people with their businesses, I realised that most business owners are amazing at what they do, but they're not necessarily good with their personal finances or their business finances. I was naturally good at that and I loved it. So that was where I really started to hone in on. It took me years and years to figure out that I could have my own voice in that space, that I could talk about shoes, fashion and money and that people liked hearing about like that.

WHEN DID YOU START YOUR OWN BUSINESS?
I was 28 when I started my first business, which was my accounting firm. I wanted to take on a few clients to do a bit more study. I wasn't going to be a world leader. My 2nd business was with Preschools, I was 40. Then the money bar, which was my financial education business a few years ago that will show my age, if I say that!

WHAT WAS IT LIKE SELLING YOUR FIRST BUSINESS?
I am one of the few female accountants where I own the accounting firm as a female sole practitioner. it was a seven-figure accounting firm and I sold it for seven figures. I think I'm probably the 1% when it comes to that. My goal was to sell it at 50% that was my financial plan. I hurt my neck last year and I couldn't work for about three months. It was just debilitating during that time, it forced me to think about why on earth am I waiting til a certain age to do something when actually I've lost the love for it? So I made a couple of calls and sold it within three months. It was hard because I have a lot of ego wrapped up in that. I was defined by that business in many respects. It took a lot of courage to walk away from it because it's the known and it brought me in an income, but it just wasn't fuelling me creatively. It wasn't making me happy and I knew it was limiting the impact I could have. It was a brave decision at the time, but it feels funny in the middle of COVID to talk about that, being brave decision when now I'm so grateful that I made that decision. I Know have that space available. I know creatively I've just been unleashed, the space for new ideas and the space for calm. I didn't realise the level of stress I was operating at and I'll look at my diary now and think Oh my God, juggling three businesses, two that are multi million dollar businesses and a start up, I'm pleased not to be doing that anymore.

WHEN DID YOU START REALISING THAT BUSINESS AND PERSONAL FINANCES ARE A TOPIC, SIMILAR TO PLASTIC SURGERY - PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO ADMIT TO IT AND DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT?
I think there's an element of shame involved and I've got to say with both, when it comes to how we look, people don't want to seem vain, whereas I see it as self confidence, not vanity. And I'm okay with having a healthy ego that says ‘I want to look at particular way’ and I see the same with money. I'm actually quite okay to say, I have built and sold a seven-figure business. I have another seven-figure business. I have plans for what I want to do with my other business. I actually think we need to want to have money, because particularly in the creative world, I don't want all the finance types to be holding the purse strings and making the financial decisions. I actually want the breadth of society to have that. Often the person that holds the purse strings and has the money, has the power. For me, when more women have that, when more creative people have that, we actually have a more balanced, more empathetic,  more

interesting society. I think once we remove it from its shame, its just another part of life. Just like eating or exercising or Botox, plastic surgery or driving a car. We just need to move it back to being a tool again that we talk about and let's be honest, women particularly, and blokes, talk about the breadth of things. Money just needs to be another thing we talk about. After sex in the city, it was a comfortable conversation with girlfriends to talk about. Suddenly you could talk blowjobs over brunch. but I cannot talk about or ask you how much you earn. No one talks about money. You were told from when you were a kid, do not talk about money.

WHY IS THAT WOMEN DON'T FEEL CONFIDENT TALKING ABOUT MONEY?
I think partly we're taught that. I'm a big believer in our money story and understanding what money stories we’re receiving, whether it's from our parents, from the media, from our peers. A lot of the money stories we had growing up were ‘that's not a dinner conversation’ and you grow up with those messages. It’s not polite to talk about money, sex and religion. Or even you had Georgie Gardner a couple of years ago when Lisa Wilkinson did the pay stand at the today show and Georgia Gardner actually came out and said, I think it's crass to talk about, about how much you learn. If we're even today being fed those lines, it's hard not to let that sink in. It's recognising those money stories we hold and then asking whether they are serving or sabotaging us. Even simple ones like a man should look after a woman financially, what does that mean for a gay couple? What does that mean if the woman owns more than a man, does it mean he’s emasculated? does it mean she won't ask for a pay rise? There’s so many issues if we don't recognise and talk about it, it's actually is hugely problematic and can cause us to sabotage. 

MELANIE
It's really interesting what you say here, because I think there's so many conversations that should be had and they are not . What was taught to me when I was a girl, life's not like that anymore. I don't want a man to come in and be Prince charming and to just look after me. I want to be able to stand on my own two feet. I'd like to be with someone where it's a balance of energy, money, everything. I don't feel that one should be better than the other, but if someone did earn more than the other than congratulations. It's not because you're a man and I'm a woman, it's because you're at a different point in your life.​These old money beliefs don’t identify or resonate with the wonderfully diverse genders of todays society either.
MELISSA
Exactly those really old-fashioned beliefs, a lot of us don't realise we're still carrying that and still acting with us.
A lot of is comparison culture and scarcity mentality, where we don't think we're enough or we don't think we're at the stage. We should be for the age that we are. So therefore we're not wanting to talk about it because we're embarrassed to wear a shamed and that more than enough lie or all, we think I'm on the creative, therefore I'm not good with money or therefore I'm not good with numbers. So I won't be enough. And it's this lie that, that really takes hold that we just start to leave out and it almost becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
MELANIE
I remember my dad saying when, because I always did well at school, but I just didn't want to continue on to 11 and 12. I couldn't stand being there. I just wanted to.
Even though I taught maths, I did well in science and did all these great demos, I was like “Get me out of here!” I didn't fit.
I wanted to go and work in the creative. I just remember dad saying, (it's only because he didn't understand) “Creative people don't make money” and he just wanted you to be secure.
it is this mindset. And then as you get older, it is like, “Well, I don't need a man”. My mum always worked. I liked having that sense of independence. I don't want someone to come in and take over my life.
MELISSA
You would believe that story, that creative people don't make money. That really could become something where you go “Oh, well, creative people don’t make money. Therefore, I'm not going to”.

IN YOUR EXPERTISE WHAT HOLDS PEOPLE BACK FROM BEING SUCCESSFUL WITH THEIR MONEY?
I think our level of financial literacy has so much to do with that. There’s global research done around falling levels of global literacy. UK research, US research, Australian research. It's not just limited to us because money's not taught in schools. We don't talk about it. Therefore, we don't have that basic really basic knowledge and understanding about it. It's something I'm fearful of because I don't understand it. I'm a bit ashamed that I don't understand it. Therefore, maybe don't want to act on it because I don't understand it, or I've made some wrong choices because I don't understand. it becomes this loop. That is where I think it needs to be threefold. It needs to be understood - having great financial awareness, understanding your money story, your money type and your money environment. I call that your financial phenotype. It's understanding, it's having, having that financial knowledge. I could tell you about every shoe designer on the planet -I have an interest in that, whereas, I'm sure you're the same, you would have things that you would just be into. If we applied that same appetite for knowledge to finances, we could have some financial knowledge. It's just that we don't have interest. Then finally it's creating financial habits that are right for our financial phenotype, for our story type and environment, everything from bank accounts and automating it or outsourcing it or gamifying it or on creating mantras, figuring out what works for you. Those three things together, I believe are what sets you up for success

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WHY DON'T PEOPLE JUST START LOOKING AT THEIR FINANCES?
They'll have heard horror stories, or you get this paralysis by analysis where it's “I'm so terrified. I want to ask, but I just can't”. My husband was a perfect example of that. When I met him, he was 40 (I tell the story in my book So I know he won't mind me saying it) he hadn't bought a house cause he'd always been, “Oh, I'm not sure. I'm not sure what the market's doing”, but he had lots of money in the bank, he hadn't actually taken this step.I think he started to be coloured by so many people where we don't have the knowledge, we're fearful.
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TOP THREE STEPS TO GET YOU BACK ON TRACK?
I would have some financial awareness. I think it's imperative that we understand our money. We understand things like is money good or bad. We understand our money is tied just so that we know why we're behaving the way we are. Otherwise, I think its kind of like a diet will get caught in a loop. It'll be a short-term fix and then we'll come out of it. I think once we understand money talking about money story, we can actually set up great habits. It’s actually facing way you're at as well. So, a lot of people haven't financially looked at where they're at. They won't open their credit card statement. They won't face it actually facing what I call ground zero and say “Wow, I'm better than I thought” or “Actually, you know what, this sucks that this is okay because it's a moment and now I can make a plan for it”. Then it's developing great habits weather it is going and setting up mould and bank accounts with auto, whether it's automating your payments so that you're not in charge, whether it's creating systems such as financial challenges and gamification, so that you are excited about money and it just is happening in the background. if I could say three things to do that, I would be the three things.

WHAT PERCEPTION AROUND MONEY WOULD LIKE TO CHANGE?
Oh my God. So much. I love the analogy of the sex and the city conversation. I want it to be just another thing that we talk about. I just want it to be normal that we'll go to dinner and we'll talk about you or talk about your relationship or talk about you share it because I'm sure they have fantastic. Maybe we'll talk about the economy. We'll talk about carbon. We'll talk about Trump. We'll talk about finances. We'll talk about that. We're talking about the property market. We're talking about business. Like just another thing that we talk about. That would be normalise it.

SHAMED & EMBARRASSED BY FINANCE SITUATIONS IN THE PAST?
You only move forward by moving forward. I think when you hit that low, so many people have felt it and thought “Oh my God, I never thought this would happen. I never expected to be in this place. How can I not have enough to see me through the next couple of weeks until we figure out what's going to go on?” Absolutely everything was felt back in March, which is why suddenly more people were talking about money in the last two months than I think anyone has talked in the last 10 years, which I really love, if that's the thing that comes out of COVID as well as some kindness, empathy, kindness and we can talk about money.

WHAT’S THE INSPIRATION & KEY MESSAGING FOR THE NEW BOOK?
What I've noticed more and more, is that people want a seven-step plan when it comes to finances, just give me the seven steps to financial freedom. But the financial advice industry does that that say ‘you're a conservative person, go into that, you’re a high risk profile this is the product for you, you’re a spender, are you a saver this is for you’. Whereas I don't believe there is that one size fits all. I'm saying too many people give up on their finances because they don 't fit in that one size fits all approach. And I believe that understanding who you are is just as important as what you know, which is what this book's all about. It's understanding who you are and then choosing habits and an environment that are right for you. And it is this concept that I've called your financial phenotype. I think people love discovering and figuring out about themselves and I hope that when they figure it out, they'll realise, “Oh, that's why money's being a hassle for me, that's why money just hasn't quite fitted because I've been trying to fit myself into a round hole when actually I’m the square peg and try something different”. Wouldn't it be crazy if I came into your apartment complex and said right, here’s your meal plans for the week. You’re all going to eat exactly the same thing, exactly the same serving size, regardless of who you are, what gender, what you're trying to achieve, what allergies, or food choices e.g. vegan. You'd be up in arms. “I want choice. It is not right for me, I'm in training", whatever it is, it's about figuring out what's right for you and then creating the system that works for you. We understand it for food. We understand it for exercise. It's about understanding it for your finances.

Shop Melissa's books here

​WHAT DOES YOUR BOOK WRITING PROCESS LOOK LIKE?
To be honest, the thinking behind this book was probably five years and the writing is fo me to just to block time away, sit down and write. Even if it's rubbish, I say to myself at this time in this moment, this is when I'm writing. So that it's a discipline. It feels like a slog sometimes because you know that it's going to be 60,000 - 70,000 words, when you're halfway through, it can feel like a slog. You've just got to have that disciplined approach to putting time aside, sitting down and doing it. I remember I saw Elizabeth Gilbert speak once and she said, you can set up a beautiful environment and burn candles and think, now it will just come, but it's not necessarily just going to arrive because the environment's right. You have to get into that discipline of doing it and getting rid of the shitty first draft as Brene Brown says, and then keep going and keep going.

THE PURPOSE BEHIND YOUR ONLINE FINANCE EDUCATION?
What I realised, particularly as being an introvert and wanting to have this reach where I create transform and change people's finances, is there's only so much you can do one on one. Also in the financial advice world with the changes that came about as a result of the banking Royal commission, it's expensive to sit in front of a financial advisor if they're not associated with a bank where they’re essentially pushing bank products. I wanted to make it so that you could educate yourself and then take charge of your own financing. That's exactly why I created the online courses. One's financial adulating, where we look at everything from financial awareness through to financial knowledge, through to habits, are the three pillars that I'm super interested in. We're just about to create an evergreen one based on budgets don't work, right? It's like a light course just to give you a bit of a feel and a business course. The business make over series.
MELANIE
It's great because it keeps people accountable and to an external, not just themselves when they haven't necessarily locked in that discipline yet.
MELISSA
Yes. Absolutely and it's cheaper than sitting one on one and You get to learn.
An affordable price was so important to us for the financial adulting plan, for example, it's less than a cup of coffee a day. You are able to create your own financial plan and you pay $3,000 plus to have that done. You learn how to do it for less than a cup of coffee a day plus in it, I do a one hour live Q and A every week. In one of the weeks, I actually open up my shares and show you how I trade in shares, also my self managed super fund, how I buy shares and what's my reasoning behind it. I feel like people aren't doing that. Certainly, people in the course when this happened, I had them contacting me, and saying "the shares are on sale and I've decided, now's a good time. I've got this long buy hold strategy, now it's a good time". I'm like, Oh my gosh, it was just such a beautiful thing to here people get it and be able to act because they put their buffers aside. They had some cash and they understood, they had that financial knowledge. They could act this is fricking exciting!